Subject: devel-digest V2 #155
From: [email-masked] (devel-digest)
To: [email-masked]

devel-digest         Thursday, April 29 1999         Volume 02 : Number 155

In this issue:

    Re: problems with TITAN distribution
    Re: more flash troubles
    NetWinder-Firmware-HOWTO now available
    Re: more flash troubles
    Re: problems with TITAN distribution
    X problems ...
    unable to chown: system call not available
    Re: X problems ...
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    where ftp
    Re: where ftp
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    Re: where ftp
    Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    problems with ssh
    missing libvga.h ?
    Re: problems with ssh
    Re: missing libvga.h ?
    Re: unable to chown: system call not available 
    Re: missing libvga.h ?
    Re: missing libvga.h ?
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: X problems ...
    about x86 assembly program
    Re: about x86 assembly program
    Re: about x86 assembly program
    GNOME
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Sendmail trouble ... (sigh..)
    Re: problems with ssh
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: about x86 assembly program 
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: missing libvga.h ?
    Re: missing libvga.h ?
    Re: missing libvga.h ?
    RE: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution
    Apache 1.3?
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Suspected 21285 deadlock?
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock? 
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?
    unknow host system type
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock? 
    Re: unknow host system type 
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock? 
    Re: unknow host system type
    Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?
    Re: GNOME
    Re: GNOME
    Re: GNOME
    Re: GNOME
    Re: GNOME
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: unknow host system type
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: Apache 1.3? 
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz
    Re: Apache 1.3? 
    Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz
    Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz
    Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz
    2.2.6-rmk2
    Benchmarks was Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: Benchmarks was Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: Benchmarks was Re: Apache 1.3?
    Re: GNOME
    Memory
    Re: Memory
    Re: Memory
    Re: Memory
    Re: Memory
    Re: Memory
    TCP performance numbers
    Re: TCP performance numbers 
    Re: TCP performance numbers
    Re: TCP performance numbers 
    Re: TCP performance numbers
    Re: Memory
    Re: TCP performance numbers 
    video in/out problems

See the end of this digest for information about devel-digest.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 00:40:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: problems with TITAN distribution

On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Amlan Saha wrote:

> when I ping, I can get the replies alright, but along with 
> every ICMP reply that is received, I also get a diagnostic
> message "ping: recvfrom: bad file descriptor".  I cant seem
> to be able to explain this because, I am receiving the ICMP
> replies and other network programs (viz., telnet, ftp) work
> fine.

If glibc decides to build tonight, there will be a new version tomorrow
afternoon when I get in.  This will fix the ping problem, among others.
Thanks to Scott.

> Also, I dont seem to be able to get the core X-distribution
> piece in the TITAN material (306 MB odd).  It has the fonts
> and other stuff needed for X but I can't seem to find the
> core piece.  Can someone point me to the right direction ??

The X stuff is currently not all that stable.  It has some 24 bit code in
a library somewhere that I have to go track down.  This is ignoring the
tv.h problem...

You can grab something that seems to work for me (provided you ignore all
the error messages when using it :)) from:

	ftp.nw.carleton.ca
	/pub/winder-testing/RPMS/XFree86-*3.3.3.1-36.titan.a.armv4l.rpm

My cheap way to get it to run is 
	cd /usr/X11R6/bin
	mv X X.orig
	ln -s XF68_FBDev X
	startx

On an unrelated note, a problem at my end?

Connecting to news.netwinder.org...
www.netwinder.org InterNetNews NNRP server INN 1.7.2 08-Dec-1997 ready
(posting
ok).
Server expects authentication.
    Please enter username: stewart    
    Please enter password: 
Authorized for user: stewart
Reading input history file...
Reading groups from active file... 
servers active-file contains no newsgroups. Exiting.
Disconnecting from server...

- -Rms

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Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 05:35:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: Chuck Stuart <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: more flash troubles

On Mon, 19 Apr 1999, Ralph Siemsen wrote:

> Chuck Stuart wrote:
> > 
> > Once the details are worked out, can they be shared?  I hope to never have
> > to use a serial kernel download, but the discussion is quite
> > interesting...
> 
> Absolutely... I actually spent the better part of the weekend writing a
> Firmware-HOWTO for the NetWinder.  I'll be adding the serial-booting
> information shortly.  Meantime, if anybody would like to review what I've
> got so far, let me know.
> 

I volunteer ... 

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Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 09:00:34 -0400
From: Ralph Siemsen <[email-masked]>
Subject: NetWinder-Firmware-HOWTO now available

Hi All,

It still has a few rough edges, but the "Firmware-HOWTO" is now available in
my home directory -
http://www.netwinder.org/~ralphs/howto/Firmware-HOWTO.html is the url. 
There aren't any links to this page yet, but I intend to update the "devel"
page next and fix this.  There might still be some typos in the HOWTO, I
hope not too many.  I will wait a couple of days for feedback before
announcing this HOWTO on the main web page or on the "announce" list.

It includes a section on serial-downloading of kernels (when writing the
flash has failed, this can sometimes help).  For those of you who following
Warren Little's adventures in flash writing, you'll be happy to know that he
has managed to rescue his system using the serial method.

The howto is written with sgmltools and CSS, my first try for both.  If
there are any sgml guru's out there, please drop me a line - I've got some
questions for you.

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 17:46:16 -0700
From: Gordon Bryck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: more flash troubles

>Chuck Stuart wrote:
>>
>> Once the details are worked out, can they be shared?  I hope to never have
>> to use a serial kernel download, but the discussion is quite
>> interesting...
>
>Absolutely... I actually spent the better part of the weekend writing a
>Firmware-HOWTO for the NetWinder.  I'll be adding the serial-booting
>information shortly.  Meantime, if anybody would like to review what I've
>got so far, let me know.
>
>--
>Ralph Siemsen -- [email-masked]
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That would be good for me to try.

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:16:34 +0800
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: problems with TITAN distribution

Thanks for the pointer. I just finished the download this morning.
But I had the following problem -

When I tried to run the FB server using startx,  it breaks
during startup giving me the message -

fbdevScreenInit: unable to set screen params (Invalid argument)

TIA
- -amlan.

   > Also, I dont seem to be able to get the core X-distribution
   > piece in the TITAN material (306 MB odd).  It has the fonts
   > and other stuff needed for X but I can't seem to find the
   > core piece.  Can someone point me to the right direction ??

   The X stuff is currently not all that stable.  It has some 24 bit code in
   a library somewhere that I have to go track down.  This is ignoring the
   tv.h problem...

   You can grab something that seems to work for me (provided you ignore all
   the error messages when using it :)) from:

	   ftp.nw.carleton.ca
	   /pub/winder-testing/RPMS/XFree86-*3.3.3.1-36.titan.a.armv4l.rpm

   My cheap way to get it to run is 
	   cd /usr/X11R6/bin
	   mv X X.orig
	   ln -s XF68_FBDev X
	   startx

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   ** I speak only for myself and NOT for my employer. **

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:06:01 +0730 (SST)
From: Amlan Saha <[email-masked]>
Subject: X problems ...

Hi all

I downloaded the X code from carleton (RawHide 1.3.1) and tried to get it
running.  However, I getting this message now -

fbdevScreenInit: unable to get screen params (Invalid argument)

Am I missing something ?

- -amlan.

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:32:21 -0500
From: "Chris Garrigues" <[email-masked]>
Subject: unable to chown: system call not available

- --==_Exmh_1693864168P
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

[ Sorry if this is a repeat.  I sent it yesterday but I haven't seen it on the 
list yet ]

What have I broken if attemtps to call chown() return "system call not 
available"?

I've got a co-located system (about an hour south of me) which has been very
unstable.  In an attempt to make it stop dying on me, I just installed a new 
kernel as well as a bunch of new RPMs.

Obviously something important is now out of sync with something else 
important, but I don't know what.

I don't really understand what's going on at the level that it's now broken.

I gather that chown is somewhere in libc from this:

)# nm libc.*|grep chown
chown.o:
00000000 T __chown
00000000 W chown
fchown.o:
00000000 T __fchown
00000000 W fchown
lchown.o:
00000000 T __lchown
00000000 W lchown
         U __chown
nm: libc.so: File format not recognized

Here's the version of libc that I'm running:

# ls -l libc.*
- -rw-r--r--   1 root     root     14616870 Mar 26 15:20 libc.a
- -rw-r--r--   1 root     root          178 Mar 26 15:21 libc.so

and I got it by installing these RPMs:

# rpm -qa|grep glibc
glibc-2.1-0.990326
glibc-devel-2.1-0.990326
glibc-profile-2.1-0.990326

The chown command works.

Chris

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:33:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: X problems ...

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Amlan Saha wrote:

> fbdevScreenInit: unable to get screen params (Invalid argument)
> 
> Am I missing something ?

Do you have the /dev/fb? entries.  I forget if they are in the current
stuff I have, or if I had to create them.  You need:

crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,   0 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb0
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,  32 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb1
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,  64 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb2
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,  96 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb3
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 128 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb4
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 160 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb5
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 192 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb6
crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 224 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb7

Actually you only need the first one, I believe.

- -Rms

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:15:53 -0500
From: "Chris Garrigues" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

- --==_Exmh_1740345642P
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

> From:  "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
> Date:  Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:45:19 -0400 (EDT)
>
> Based on the fact you are running this glibc, I assume you installed ALL
> the other rpms from the Carleton site?  If not you will have really big
> problems.

Many, but not all.  I'll take this comment seriously.  Thanks.

> Have you tried rebooting?  I've had this before, when upgrading really old
> NetWinder images.  Rebooting seems to fix.

I haven't yet; in part because I'm nervous about it not coming back up.

> Oh, and I make no statements about the stability of the Titan stuff,
> especially if you want to run X, or a main server on it.

No X and it's not a "main" server by any means.  (If it were, I'd be running 
an x86; I'm no fool.)

Chris

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:38:50 -0500
From: "Chris Garrigues" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

- --==_Exmh_1753158308P
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

> From:  "Chris Garrigues" <[email-masked]>
> Date:  Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:15:53 -0500
>
> > From:  "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
> > Date:  Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:45:19 -0400 (EDT)
> >
> > Based on the fact you are running this glibc, I assume you installed ALL
> > the other rpms from the Carleton site?  If not you will have really big
> > problems.
> 
> Many, but not all.  I'll take this comment seriously.  Thanks.

I had to rebuild my RPM database.  A bunch of these RPMs are looking for
/bin/sh or various X libraries.  glibc wants kernel-headers.  To keep RPM 
happy, I'd like to reinstall them, but I don't find these on the Carleton site. 
Which versions should I be using?

Chris

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                                +1 512 374 0500

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:24:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Chris Garrigues wrote:
> > From:  "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
> > Date:  Wed, 21 Apr 1999 10:45:19 -0400 (EDT)
> >
> > Based on the fact you are running this glibc, I assume you installed ALL
> > the other rpms from the Carleton site?  If not you will have really big
> > problems.
> 
> Many, but not all.  I'll take this comment seriously.  Thanks.

I meant, you are not running with binaries from Corel as well as ones from
the Titan stuff.  This would be a very bad thing.  You cannot mix and
match the binaries.

And there is newer stuff at
	ftp.nw.carleton.ca/pub/winder-testing/new/RPMS

And if you grab the latest glibc-990419, ping will work properly.

> > Have you tried rebooting?  I've had this before, when upgrading really old
> > NetWinder images.  Rebooting seems to fix.
> 
> I haven't yet; in part because I'm nervous about it not coming back up.

You will have to reboot, sorry..

- -Rms

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:47:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Chris Garrigues wrote:

> I had to rebuild my RPM database.  A bunch of these RPMs are looking for
> /bin/sh or various X libraries.  glibc wants kernel-headers.  To keep RPM 
> happy, I'd like to reinstall them, but I don't find these on the Carleton site. 
> Which versions should I be using?

Thanks for reminding me.  I still have a problem with bash.  For now you
can grab one that works.  This stems from the fact that Red Hat is
not going to use bash version 2 as their default bash in RH 6.0
	pub/winder-testing/RPMS/bash-2.02.1-3.armv4l.rpm

You can get the kernel source rpm from
	pub/winder-testing/kernel/kernel-source

I still recommend building your own kernel...
	ftp.nw.carleton.ca

I'm in the process of rebuilding a bunch of rpms (well all the one from
the last starbuck release).  I've given up on trying to get the latest
egcs to work properly, and am still using 1.1.2

- -Rms

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:28:28 -0500
From: "Darryl DeGraff" <[email-masked]>
Subject: where ftp

Does anyone know where
     ftp.netwinder.org
went?  Also, I don't see much activity (basically none, except for test
messages) on
     news.netwinder.org
What's happening with that?

Darryl

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:23:22 -0400
From: Ralph Siemsen <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: where ftp

Darryl DeGraff wrote:
> 
> Does anyone know where
>      ftp.netwinder.org

We're fighting with the machine that houses the ftp site currently. 
Hopefully will be back up before to long.  Don't worry, everything is backed
up just in case.

>      news.netwinder.org
> What's happening with that?

Nobody is using it... once the network issues stabilize, we'll begin a
stronger campaing to use the news server.

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:26:26 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

>What have I broken if attemtps to call chown() return "system call not 
>available"?

You have probably installed a version of libc that expects a 2.2 kernel, while 
still running a 2.0 kernel.  This, unfortunately, is an area where providing 
full binary compatibility would be too painful for the perceived benefits.

p.

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:34:27 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: where ftp

Darryl DeGraff writes:
> Does anyone know where
>      ftp.netwinder.org
> went?  Also, I don't see much activity (basically none, except for test
> messages) on
>      news.netwinder.org
> What's happening with that?

There were two conflicting name servers, which were causing intermittent
problems.  This has now been resolved, but some people will have to wait
for the name servers to resync before access can be gained.

You could use the IP address of netwinder.org (207.245.35.202) until your
nameservers resync.
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |         Russell King        [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |   http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/aboutme.html    /  /  |
  | +-+-+                                                     --- -+-
  /   |               THE developer of ARM Linux              |+| /|\
 /  | | |                                                     ---  |
    +-+-+ -------------------------------------------------  /\\\  |
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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:41:07 -0400
From: Kevin Driedger <[email-masked]>
Subject: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

Here is the URL:
http://www.corel.com/news/1999/april/april_21_1999.htm

I wonder what this means for the RedHat based distribution for our
Netwinders... perhaps now that HCC owns the rights that it does not mean
much.

Comments???

]{evin (proud Netwinder owner).

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:13:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: NightOwl <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

> I wonder what this means for the RedHat based distribution for our
> Netwinders... perhaps now that HCC owns the rights that it does not mean
> much.

It means nothing so long as I'm in charge of the NetWinder OS,
and working for HCC not Corel.

The distribution on the NetWinder is NOT Red Hat either; I call
it "NetWinder ARM".  It is heavily influenced by Red Hat, and
uses rpm (easy to use, easy to automate, and I prefer it), but
it is not released by Red Hat or 100% compliant.

For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:25:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alex deVries <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, NightOwl wrote:
> For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
> packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.

What are the additions?

- - Alex

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PA RISC Linux Porting Team

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:52:54 -0500
From: "Chris Garrigues" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

- --==_Exmh_-2087743054P
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

> From:  Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
> Date:  Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:26:26 +0100
>
> >What have I broken if attemtps to call chown() return "system call not 
> >available"?
> 
> You have probably installed a version of libc that expects a 2.2 kernel, wh
> ile 
> still running a 2.0 kernel.  This, unfortunately, is an area where providin
> g 
> full binary compatibility would be too painful for the perceived benefits.

That appears to be the problem.  I tried grabbing the 2.2 kernel from carlton 
since that's where I got the glibc, but it seems to want me to be running 
NeTTrom 2.0.6...but I can't find that anywhere.  Pointers?

As I type this, I'm downloading the kernel-source from carlton, but I noticed 
in a readme that it would require source changes to work with 2.0.4...

~sigh~  I went from an unstable system to a broken system.  I sure hope when I 
come out the other side I have a stable system.

Chris

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    Nobody ever got fired for buying Microsoft,
      but they could get fired for relying on Microsoft.

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:51:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Alex deVries wrote:

> 
> On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, NightOwl wrote:
> > For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
> > packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.
> 
> What are the additions?

Flashwrite for one :)

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"At a risk of being called sexist, ageist and French, if you put 
multimedia, a leather skirt and lipstick on a grandmother and take her 
to a night club, she's still not going to get lucky." -- Jean Louis 
Gassee (of Be) on Windows 2000 being "multimedia."

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:14:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Chris Garrigues wrote:

> That appears to be the problem.  I tried grabbing the 2.2 kernel from carlton 
> since that's where I got the glibc, but it seems to want me to be running 
> NeTTrom 2.0.6...but I can't find that anywhere.  Pointers?

This stems from the fact that NeTTrom < 2.0.6 (i.e. 2.0.4) would not pass
command line parameters to the kernel properly.  This is fixed, partially,
in NeTTrom 2.0.6/7.

So if you still have NeTTrom 2.0.4 you need to set the command line
parameters when you configure your kernel.  Something like:
	root=/dev/hda1 ro mem=32M

Or you can try upgrading NeTTrom, there is a copy in Woody's directory on
netwinder.org...  This comes with many warnings and all.  Also I've not
tried flashing a NeTTrom image with the Titan stuff, so I would not
recommend that.

If you want, e-mail me with your config for root, and amount of memory and
I can compile a 2.2 kernel for you.

> As I type this, I'm downloading the kernel-source from carlton, but I noticed 
> in a readme that it would require source changes to work with 2.0.4...
> 
> ~sigh~  I went from an unstable system to a broken system.  I sure hope when I 
> come out the other side I have a stable system.

Broken is a relative term.. :-)  I've gone through many, but I have all
the NetWinders here in one room, and can nfs boot off my ix86 box when
things get really broken :)

Good luck,
- -Rms

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:59:00 -0500
From: David Willis <[email-masked]>
Subject: problems with ssh

when i try to connect to netwinder.org using ssh (ssh-2.0.12 under
digital unix, f-secure ssh 2.0 under windoze) i get the error message

    "Disconnected; protocol version not supported (Illegal protocol
version.)."

being that i've never used ssh before, i haven't a clue what the problem
is. any suggestions?

thanks,

dave

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:02:04 -0700 (BST)
From: Tim Rowledge <[email-masked]>
Subject: missing libvga.h ?

When attempting to recompile
/usr/diag/testscripts/video_aout/vidcap/vidcap_test, I get an error becasue
/usr/include/vgagl.h cannot include ../src/vaglib.h

There does not appear to be any such file on my machine - should there be?
Should it be possible for my machine to recompile this vidcap_test program?
Should the program even be tried out on my machine? I hoped it might demo
taking video in from a camera and putting it out to a video monitor, something
I need to get working sometime soon.

tim

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:13:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: problems with ssh

You need ssh 1.2.26. ssh 2.0 uses an incompatible protocol (and license).

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, David Willis wrote:

> when i try to connect to netwinder.org using ssh (ssh-2.0.12 under
> digital unix, f-secure ssh 2.0 under windoze) i get the error message
> 
>     "Disconnected; protocol version not supported (Illegal protocol
> version.)."
> 
> being that i've never used ssh before, i haven't a clue what the problem
> is. any suggestions?
> 
> thanks,
> 
> dave
> 
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_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"At a risk of being called sexist, ageist and French, if you put 
multimedia, a leather skirt and lipstick on a grandmother and take her 
to a night club, she's still not going to get lucky." -- Jean Louis 
Gassee (of Be) on Windows 2000 being "multimedia."

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:14:33 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: missing libvga.h ?

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Tim Rowledge wrote:

> When attempting to recompile
> /usr/diag/testscripts/video_aout/vidcap/vidcap_test, I get an error becasue
> /usr/include/vgagl.h cannot include ../src/vaglib.h

This should work.  I believe there is a copy on
	ftp.newinder.org/users/d/douglasp/

	[stewart@zhadum ~/mail]# rpm -qf  /usr/include/vgagl.h
	svgalib-devel-1.3.1-2

- -Rms

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:19:03 -0500
From: "Chris Garrigues" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unable to chown: system call not available 

- --==_Exmh_-1994874932P
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

> From:  "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
> Date:  Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:14:31 -0400 (EDT)
>
> If you want, e-mail me with your config for root, and amount of memory and
> I can compile a 2.2 kernel for you.

Thanks for the offer.  My disk is partitioned the way it came from CCC:

Filesystem         1024-blocks  Used Available Capacity Mounted on
/dev/hda1            1014784  787643   174702     82%   /
/dev/hda3             969221  106876   812273     12%   /home

...and as for memory:

        total:    used:    free:  shared: buffers:  cached:
Mem:  64942080 63479808  1462272 19374080 34127872 17313792
Swap: 67604480     4096 67600384
MemTotal:     63420 kB
MemFree:       1428 kB
MemShared:    18920 kB
Buffers:      33328 kB
Cached:       16908 kB
SwapTotal:    66020 kB
SwapFree:     66016 kB

> Broken is a relative term.. :-)  I've gone through many, but I have all
> the NetWinders here in one room, and can nfs boot off my ix86 box when
> things get really broken :)

Yeah, I'm playing it a little dangerously here by being a hour north of my 
NetWinder, but that's what makes it fun... ;-(

When I first started running mkLinux on my Mac, it was just as bad, but it's 
gotten real stable lately.  I now only reboot when a new kernel is available.

Chris

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 18:30:09 -0700 (BST)
From: Tim Rowledge <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: missing libvga.h ?

> > /usr/include/vgagl.h cannot include ../src/vaglib.h
> 
> This should work.  I believe there is a copy on
> 	ftp.newinder.org/users/d/douglasp/
> 
> 	[stewart@zhadum ~/mail]# rpm -qf  /usr/include/vgagl.h
> 	svgalib-devel-1.3.1-2
Odd - I get:-
file /usr/include/vgagl.h is not owned by any package

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:35:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: missing libvga.h ?

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Tim Rowledge wrote:

> > 	[stewart@zhadum ~/mail]# rpm -qf  /usr/include/vgagl.h
> > 	svgalib-devel-1.3.1-2
> Odd - I get:-
> file /usr/include/vgagl.h is not owned by any package

Sorry I did that on my ix86 box.  I am assuming it would be included in
that package.  And you can get that package from douglasp's directory.

- -Rms

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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:40:01 -0400
From: "Ming Poon" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- --------------014AAADCD2B67C6A2685F91B
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

We do have some form of contractual agreement with HCC to provide them with
a version of our distro for the NetWinder. How HCC may use it is really up
to them. I imagine it would be used on the long awaited NetWinder LC
version.

If HCC do use them, it would mean a much simpler upgrade process - possibly
as simple as a single mouse click to upgrade the whole system or a single
individual package with full dependency checks. That is the beauty of
Debian. There are many other features in our distro that will be unique if
you are a desktop user. Hope this helps.

Kevin Driedger wrote:

> Here is the URL:
> http://www.corel.com/news/1999/april/april_21_1999.htm
>
> I wonder what this means for the RedHat based distribution for our
> Netwinders... perhaps now that HCC owns the rights that it does not mean
> much.
>
> Comments???
>
> ]{evin (proud Netwinder owner).
>
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Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 21:46:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

If we can use it, we'd worship you.

Honest. :)

I have a Netwinder DM myself. :)

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, Ming Poon wrote:

> We do have some form of contractual agreement with HCC to provide them with
> a version of our distro for the NetWinder. How HCC may use it is really up
> to them. I imagine it would be used on the long awaited NetWinder LC
> version.
> 
> If HCC do use them, it would mean a much simpler upgrade process - possibly
> as simple as a single mouse click to upgrade the whole system or a single
> individual package with full dependency checks. That is the beauty of
> Debian. There are many other features in our distro that will be unique if
> you are a desktop user. Hope this helps.

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"At a risk of being called sexist, ageist and French, if you put 
multimedia, a leather skirt and lipstick on a grandmother and take her 
to a night club, she's still not going to get lucky." -- Jean Louis 
Gassee (of Be) on Windows 2000 being "multimedia."

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:15:38 +0730 (SST)
From: Amlan Saha <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: X problems ...

> > fbdevScreenInit: unable to get screen params (Invalid argument)
> > 
> > Am I missing something ?
> 
> Do you have the /dev/fb? entries.  I forget if they are in the current
> stuff I have, or if I had to create them.  You need:
> 
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,   0 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb0
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,  32 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb1
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,  64 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb2
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29,  96 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb3
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 128 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb4
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 160 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb5
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 192 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb6
> crw-r--r--   1 root     root      29, 224 Apr  3 18:03 /dev/fb7
> 

Infact, I have all of these already. Anything else that I can check ?
Basically, all that is in the machine is a straight download of the
TITAN binaries.

- -amlan.

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:05:12 +0800
From: "Junder Wu" <[email-masked]>
Subject: about x86 assembly program

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_00DE_01BE8CD1.8538D3A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="x-user-defined"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Can i just simply translate some of the x86 assembly programs into ARM =
style, by using a cross assembler?   Maybe just like cross compiler =
EGCS?
=20
Thanks,

Junder Wu

- ------=_NextPart_000_00DE_01BE8CD1.8538D3A0
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	charset="x-user-defined"
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<HTML>
<HEAD>

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http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Can i just simply translate some of =
the x86=20
assembly programs into ARM style, by using a cross =
assembler?&nbsp;&nbsp; Maybe=20
just like cross compiler EGCS?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Junder Wu</FONT></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_00DE_01BE8CD1.8538D3A0--

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 00:25:23 -0700
From: "Eric A. Perlman" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: about x86 assembly program

On Thu, Apr 22, 1999 at 03:05:12PM +0800, Junder Wu wrote:
> Can i just simply translate some of the x86 assembly programs into ARM style, by using a cross assembler?   Maybe just like cross compiler EGCS?
>  

I don't think so.  Cross compilers compile the code into another architecture's assembly.  I don't think there are many assemblers out there that translate assembly from on arch to another, but then, I could be wrong. ;)

- -eric
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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 16:46:43 +0800
From: "Junder Wu" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: about x86 assembly program

>On Thu, Apr 22, 1999 at 03:05:12PM +0800, Junder Wu wrote:
>> Can i just simply translate some of the x86 assembly programs into ARM
style, by using a cross assembler?   Maybe just like cross compiler EGCS?
>>
>
>I don't think so.  Cross compilers compile the code into another
architecture's assembly.  I don't think there are many assemblers out there
that translate assembly from on arch to another, but then, I could be wrong.
;)
>
>-eric
>--

We are using the manual method now, translate the x86 assembly programs by
our own hand. So i just wonder if there would be some tools to do this job.

thanks

junder

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 12:56:20 +0200
From: "Jan Rinze" <[email-masked]>
Subject: GNOME

Hi there,

Has anyone outhere tried to compile GNOME 1.0 ?

If so please put a tar ball at ftp.netwinder.org..

Jan Rinze.

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 06:06:03 -0500
From: "Darryl DeGraff" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

Andrew E. Mileski (andrewm @ netwinder.org) wrote:
>>For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
>>packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.

I noticed an ad for NetWinder (from HCC, now) in the latest Linux
Journal.  They did not mention a DM version.  Is it being dropped
from commercial availability?

Looking forward to that next release.  Is end of May still the target?
Any possibility of sooner?

darryl

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:47:22 -0400
From: Scott Bambrough <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

Darryl DeGraff wrote:
> 
> Andrew E. Mileski (andrewm @ netwinder.org) wrote:
> >>For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
> >>packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.
> 
> I noticed an ad for NetWinder (from HCC, now) in the latest Linux
> Journal.  They did not mention a DM version.  Is it being dropped
> from commercial availability?
> 
> Looking forward to that next release.  Is end of May still the target?
> Any possibility of sooner?
> 
> darryl
> 

No the DM is not being dropped.  The ads are just targetting the other models.  

Scott
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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 14:11:42 +0200
From: "Jan Rinze" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Sendmail trouble ... (sigh..)

Hi there,

I have still a problem when trying to send mail
from user to user on a netwinder.

we use a netwinder as a server so 3 people
have their own account on this server.

When sending mail from one user to the other
an error message appears.

The message is :

seteuid(0) failure (real:501 eff:1001) operation not permitted.

Does anyone know how to fix this ???

It is a DM-12.

Jan Rinze.

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:16:12 -0400
From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: problems with ssh

Deirdre Saoirse wrote:
> 
> You need ssh 1.2.26. ssh 2.0 uses an incompatible protocol (and license).

I also suggest you get the GMP patches.  There are about 7 of them
(ssh 1.2.26 has only one applied)

http://www.matematik.su.se/~tege/gmp/

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Hardware Canada Computing
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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:28:57 -0400
From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

> > For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
> > packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.
> 
> What are the additions?

That's hard to pin down exactly without listing the 400 or so extra packages.
Things like CPAN and the Red Hat Power Tools come to mind.

In fact so much has been added that I may have to strip stuff off.
If I do, the stripped packages will be available for download though.
At last look, there were around 5000 SRPMS available to chose from
[not all have been ported yet of course].

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Hardware Canada Computing
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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 19:07:34 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: about x86 assembly program 

>We are using the manual method now, translate the x86 assembly programs by
>our own hand. So i just wonder if there would be some tools to do this job.

I don't know of any.  Mechanically converting from one assembly language to 
another isn't an entirely trivial thing to do, and to be honest I haven't 
noticed that many people trying to convert x86 assembly to ARM in any volume.

What programs are you trying to port, exactly?

p.

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 15:28:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

On Wed, 21 Apr 1999, NightOwl wrote:

> For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
> packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.

Please (anyone) don't take this the wrong way or anything.  It is only
meant to be a comment.

Could people who make NetWinder specific rpms (netwinder-tv,
netwinder-flash, ...).  Add the following two lines to the spec files:
	ExclusiveArch: armv4l
	ExclusiveOS: Linux
this makes things much cleaner, and will help to avoid accidental
confusion in the long run.

As well please make certain your buildroot directory is in /var/tmp and
not /tmp by default, as this is the default behaviour (right or wrong)
that has been established.  So something like:
	Buildroot: /var/tmp/%{name}-root

Could someone please forward this to people inside HCC or anyone else, who
may not see it.

Thank you,
- -Rms

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 13:59:22 -0700 (BST)
From: Tim Rowledge <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: missing libvga.h ?

Thanks to Rod's suggestions, I have been able to get the missing libvga.h file
installed. (*)

BUT I still can't get the vidcap_test progam to run; it now complains about
'vga_hasmode' failing - but that seems less bad than various /dev/mem failures
and so on.  So far I am trying to run it in a non-X virtual console (alt-ctl-F4
if that makes any difference), since any attempt from within KDE complains
about not being in a graphics capable console. Can anyone offer pointers to
help on this? Should the program even work outside the assembly/testing
facility?

(*)Getting the rpm was 'fun'. Does anyone know how to persuade the KDE browser
to use PASSIVE for FTP connections? Our firewall gets in the way of the default
config, but manually usig FTP and setting passive is fine. Is there some sort
of .ftprc I can use? Reading the RFCs on URLs etc hasn't helped much so it's
now down to WOTL.

tim

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 [email-masked] (h)  <http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim>

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:25:10 -0400
From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: missing libvga.h ?

Tim Rowledge wrote:
> (*)Getting the rpm was 'fun'. Does anyone know how to persuade the KDE browser
> to use PASSIVE for FTP connections? Our firewall gets in the way of the default
> config, but manually usig FTP and setting passive is fine. Is there some sort
> of .ftprc I can use? Reading the RFCs on URLs etc hasn't helped much so it's
> now down to WOTL.

Use "rpm -i ftp:// ... " it uses passive to grab RPMS.
See the man page (FTP OPTIONS) for proxy details.

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Hardware Canada Computing
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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 20:37:54 -0700 (BST)
From: Tim Rowledge <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: missing libvga.h ?

On Thu 22 Apr, Andrew E. Mileski wrote:

> Use "rpm -i ftp:// ... " it uses passive to grab RPMS.
Excellent point - I remember reading about this some time ago, but I
sort-of assumed that ftp fetching wouldn't work if ftp was playing up!
> See the man page (FTP OPTIONS) for proxy details.
It is claimed that putting a
macdef init
system
passive
<lf>
<lf>
into a .netrc file will autorun the init macro after login. It certainly
does the 'system' command, but doesn't seem to do the 'passive' command.
Grrr.
Oh, and the man page doesn't mention 'passive' at all! Is there anyone I
should inform?

tim

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 22:54:27 -0500
From: "Ivan R. Judson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

What will the kernel version be based upon?  Will it be the 2.0 series, 2.1 or
perhaps Russell's 2.2 stuff?

Just wondering,

- --Ivan

- -----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On
Behalf Of Andrew E. Mileski
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 1999 10:29 AM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

> > For example, the next DM release will have about 50% more
> > packages than a standard Red Hat for x86 distribution.
>
> What are the additions?

That's hard to pin down exactly without listing the 400 or so extra packages.
Things like CPAN and the Red Hat Power Tools come to mind.

In fact so much has been added that I may have to strip stuff off.
If I do, the stripped packages will be available for download though.
At last look, there were around 5000 SRPMS available to chose from
[not all have been ported yet of course].

- --
Andrew E. Mileski - Software Engineer
Hardware Canada Computing
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Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:08:18 -0400
From: Ralph Siemsen <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Corel Announces a New Linux Distribution

"Ivan R. Judson" wrote:
> 
> What will the kernel version be based upon?  Will it be the 2.0 series, 2.1 or
> perhaps Russell's 2.2 stuff?

It will be based on 2.0.35, but will be 2.2-ready (meaning, that you will be
able to use a 2.2 kernel without too much fussing with all the binaries). 
To use 2.2 on netwinder requires some updates to the firmware (for parameter
passing) and these have not been sufficiently tested to make it in time for
build #14.

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Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 12:54:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Apache 1.3?

I've got the RH5.1 setup -- has anyone compiled apache 1.3 for that? I'm
going to move websites and wanted the newer (1.3) httpd.conf format vs.
the more elderly 1.2x

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"At a risk of being called sexist, ageist and French, if you put 
multimedia, a leather skirt and lipstick on a grandmother and take her 
to a night club, she's still not going to get lucky." -- Jean Louis 
Gassee (of Be) on Windows 2000 being "multimedia."

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Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 13:08:55 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
From: Rasmus Lerdorf <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

> I've got the RH5.1 setup -- has anyone compiled apache 1.3 for that? I'm
> going to move websites and wanted the newer (1.3) httpd.conf format vs.
> the more elderly 1.2x

Yup, works fine.  I haven't upgraded my Netwinder in ages and on mine I
have to put two Listen directives in the httpd.conf file to work around an
accept() bug somewhere.  But once I do that it works nicely.  It has been
up and stable for months at: http://netwinder.lerdorf.on.ca

- -Rasmus

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Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 18:54:51 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King - ARM Linux Admin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Suspected 21285 deadlock?

Hi,

Gotta small problem, which I'm hoping that people involved with building
systems around the DC21285 can shed some light on.

I've got a card with a CY82C693UB (South bridge) in my EBSA285, with an
ESS1879 sound chip on the 82C693's ISA bus.  The sound chip uses ISA DMA.
There is also a 3c592 net card on the PCI bus, Promise Ultra33 UDMA IDE
card, and an S3 Trio64V2 video card.

The problem I'm seeing is total deadlock of the SA110 when, eg, the
Ethernet is accessed while an ISA DMA is in progress to the sound chip.
I haven't tried DMAs to other devices yet.

When it deadlocks, the following always seems to be true:

1. SA110 address bus contains an address in the PCI I/O
   space of the DC21285.

2. The SA110 MCLK is held high.

3. ABE is high (address bus enabled).

4. DBE toggles.

5. The ISA DMA is still running, playing the same snippet of audio
   over and over again (since the SA110 can't update the SDRAM with the
   next block).  Hence, ISA -> PCI -> SA110 bus is still functional.

6. The PCI request and grant signals for the 82C693 are toggling.

7. The PCI request and grant signals for the DC21285 are also toggling.

8. Comparing these two grant signals, they appear to be anti-phase.

Note: other PCI masters appear to be ok.

The only way out of this state is a hardware reset.  I've tried swapping
the slot that the Promise and the Southbridge use, but that doesn't affect
it - it still deadlocks when doing ISA DMA.  I haven't yet checked to see
if this PCI I/O transaction that the SA110 is asking for is a read or a
write, but I should know that later tonight...

I suspect that this could be related to the Outbound write flush problem
(ie, issuing an outbound write flush to the DC21285 causes deadlock).
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |        Russell King       [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |  http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/armlinux.html    /  /  |
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Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 19:29:41 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock? 

>I suspect that this could be related to the Outbound write flush problem
>(ie, issuing an outbound write flush to the DC21285 causes deadlock).

Wasn't the problem with outbound flush just that that functionality didn't 
actually get implemented?

It sounds like the 21285 is trying to perform some transaction on the bus 
either to satisfy a read or to unload its write FIFO (and it's stalled the 
SA110 while it does so) but it keeps getting a retry response.  Can you 
examine the PCI bus and see what's going on in terms of the address that the 
Footbridge asserts and the response it gets from the target?

I've never seen this on any of the machines I've worked on, but none of those 
have used the same southbridge that you've got.

p.

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Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 19:50:06 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King - ARM Linux Admin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?

Philip Blundell writes:
> 
> >I suspect that this could be related to the Outbound write flush problem
> >(ie, issuing an outbound write flush to the DC21285 causes deadlock).
> 
> Wasn't the problem with outbound flush just that that functionality didn't 
> actually get implemented?

From what I remember reading, and from what Dave Gilberts' description
of what happened when he tried it with the tulip driver, I think it
does deadlock if attempted on rev. 01 21285s...

> It sounds like the 21285 is trying to perform some transaction on the bus 
> either to satisfy a read or to unload its write FIFO (and it's stalled the 
> SA110 while it does so) but it keeps getting a retry response.  Can you 
> examine the PCI bus and see what's going on in terms of the address that the 
> Footbridge asserts and the response it gets from the target?

I'll try, but all my slots are full, and I can only get to the 'B' side
of the PCI connectors safely.  This means that I can get to all but 
CBE0, STOP, SDONE and TRDY signals.  I'll also reduce the bus speed
to make it easier on the poor 60MHz scope...
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |        Russell King       [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |  http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/armlinux.html    /  /  |
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 00:00:39 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King - ARM Linux Admin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?

Russell King - ARM Linux Admin writes:
> Philip Blundell writes:
> > It sounds like the 21285 is trying to perform some transaction on the bus 
> > either to satisfy a read or to unload its write FIFO (and it's stalled the 
> > SA110 while it does so) but it keeps getting a retry response.  Can you 
> > examine the PCI bus and see what's going on in terms of the address that the 
> > Footbridge asserts and the response it gets from the target?
> 
> I'll try, but all my slots are full, and I can only get to the 'B' side
> of the PCI connectors safely.  This means that I can get to all but 
> CBE0, STOP, SDONE and TRDY signals.  I'll also reduce the bus speed
> to make it easier on the poor 60MHz scope...

Indeed yes, the SA110 this time was trying to do a PCI IACK cycle, however
the DC21285 was attempting to perform some operation at PCI address 0x21
(Control bits 0011, whatever that means), but getting retry responses from
the Southbridge.

There is a bit in the PCI config space - index 0x44, bit 4, which is
described as:

  Retry on excessive delay control:
   0: Disable retry if delay will be longer than 16 PCI clock cycles
   1: Enable retry if delay will be longer than 16 PCI clock cycles
                  (Rev. 2.1 Compliant)

If I set this bit, then the bus locks in endless retry mode.  However,
if I clear this bit, then the bus seems to lock with the Southbridges
bus request and bus grant permanently active, however it did (on my
single attempt) get slightly further.  There appears to be no DMA
active (since I don't hear anything unlike before), so I guess that
the PCI bus is stagnant.

The Southbridge doesn't seem to have a latency timer on it, nor any other
timing-related registers - it just seems to have regs 0, 2, 4, 6, 8,
9, A, B and E apart from the manufacturer specific regs at 0x40 and
above.  Naturally for DMA, it has the normal PC DMA register set.
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |        Russell King       [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |  http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/armlinux.html    /  /  |
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Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 21:47:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: RHS Linux User <[email-masked]>
Subject: unknow host system type

When I run configure in some packages (gimp for example), I get

checking host system type... Invalid configuration
`armv4l-unknown-linux-gnu': machine `armv4l-unknown' not recognized
                                         
and eventual failure. How do I get around this problem?
Thanks for any clues. -ben

Ben Smith         Ketch -- Mother of Perl
                [email-masked]

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:01:09 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock? 

>Indeed yes, the SA110 this time was trying to do a PCI IACK cycle, however
>the DC21285 was attempting to perform some operation at PCI address 0x21
>(Control bits 0011, whatever that means), but getting retry responses from
>the Southbridge.

Command 0011 is an I/O write, and of course ISA I/O address 0x21 is the 
first PIC.  Since IACK is a read cycle it almost certainly requires the 
outbound FIFO to be flushed.

>if I clear this bit, then the bus seems to lock with the Southbridges
>bus request and bus grant permanently active, however it did (on my
>single attempt) get slightly further.  There appears to be no DMA

It's hard to say what happens in this case.  From the description you've given 
of the control bit, I'd expect the lock-up to occur with the 21285 having bus 
ownership (because it sits waiting for a TRDY that never comes; the latency 
timer doesn't really protect you against this case).

>The Southbridge doesn't seem to have a latency timer on it, nor any other
>timing-related registers - it just seems to have regs 0, 2, 4, 6, 8,
>9, A, B and E apart from the manufacturer specific regs at 0x40 and
>above.  Naturally for DMA, it has the normal PC DMA register set.

It may well not have a latency timer if it's not capable of burst transfers.  
Even if it did, it wouldn't help in either of the failure modes you're seeing 
- -- in the first one you described, the southbridge is correctly relinquishing 
the bus anyway, and in the second one the arbiter isn't removing its GNT so 
the latency timer would have no effect.

Does the documentation or errata for the southbridge say anything about the 
circumstances under which it responds with retry to target write transactions?

p.

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 11:20:42 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unknow host system type 

>When I run configure in some packages (gimp for example), I get
>
>checking host system type... Invalid configuration
>`armv4l-unknown-linux-gnu': machine `armv4l-unknown' not recognized

Replace the config.guess and config.sub scripts with the latest versions, say 
the ones from glibc 2.1.

p.

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:15:50 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King - ARM Linux Admin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?

Philip Blundell writes:
> Command 0011 is an I/O write, and of course ISA I/O address 0x21 is the 
> first PIC.  Since IACK is a read cycle it almost certainly requires the 
> outbound FIFO to be flushed.

Aha, as I was expecting...

> It's hard to say what happens in this case.  From the description you've given 
> of the control bit, I'd expect the lock-up to occur with the 21285 having bus 
> ownership (because it sits waiting for a TRDY that never comes; the latency 
> timer doesn't really protect you against this case).

I don't think the 21285 is at fault - it's looking like the Southbridge chip
isn't behaving as PCI 2.1 would expect.  Ok, it's giving retries which are allowed,
but surely it should not block accesses while a DMA operation is in progress (since
you therefore cannot get to the DMA controller or device to stop it).

> It may well not have a latency timer if it's not capable of burst transfers.  
> Even if it did, it wouldn't help in either of the failure modes you're seeing 
> -- in the first one you described, the southbridge is correctly relinquishing 
> the bus anyway, and in the second one the arbiter isn't removing its GNT so 
> the latency timer would have no effect.

The arbiter is behaving as expected - in the total lock condition, the SA110 is
stalled while a memory read is processed.  However, the 21285 doesn't have anything
to do on the PCI, so it's request is not activated.  Therefore, the arbiter does
not remove the grant to the Southbridge since no other master is requesting the
bus.

> Does the documentation or errata for the southbridge say anything about the 
> circumstances under which it responds with retry to target write transactions?

While looking for this, I suspect that the problems I'm seeing is why the chip
has gone obsolete about a year ago.  Unfortunately, Cypress have cleaned their
web site of all obsolete erratas and data sheets.
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |        Russell King       [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |  http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/armlinux.html    /  /  |
  | +-+-+                                                     --- -+-
  /   |               THE developer of ARM Linux              |+| /|\
 /  | | |                                                     ---  |
    +-+-+ -------------------------------------------------  /\\\  |
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:58:35 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock? 

>> It's hard to say what happens in this case.  From the description you've
>> given of the control bit, I'd expect the lock-up to occur with the 21285 
>> having bus ownership (because it sits waiting for a TRDY that never comes; 
>> the latency timer doesn't really protect you against this case).
>
>I don't think the 21285 is at fault - it's looking like the Southbridge chip
>isn't behaving as PCI 2.1 would expect.

No, I don't think the 21285 is at fault either.  In the scenario I described 
above the 21285 is behaving correctly.  If your observations are correct and 
it does lock up with the southbridge having bus ownership then the fault could 
be at either end -- the only way to find out would be to examine the bus 
transactions that occur during and maybe just prior to the lockup.

>The arbiter is behaving as expected - in the total lock condition, the SA110 
>is stalled while a memory read is processed.  However, the 21285 doesn't have 
>anything to do on the PCI, so it's request is not activated.  Therefore, the 
>arbiter does not remove the grant to the Southbridge since no other master is 
>requesting the bus.

Yes, that was precisely my point.

>While looking for this, I suspect that the problems I'm seeing is why the chip
>has gone obsolete about a year ago.  Unfortunately, Cypress have cleaned their
>web site of all obsolete erratas and data sheets.

Oh dear.  These parts do usually have a pretty short lifespan though, typically 
just a year or two.

p.

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:16:13 -0400
From: Scott Bambrough <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unknow host system type

RHS Linux User wrote:
> 
> When I run configure in some packages (gimp for example), I get
> 
> checking host system type... Invalid configuration
> `armv4l-unknown-linux-gnu': machine `armv4l-unknown' not recognized
> 
> and eventual failure. How do I get around this problem?
> Thanks for any clues. -ben
> 
> Ben Smith         Ketch -- Mother of Perl
>                 [email-masked]
> 
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The files config.guess and config.sub need to be upgraded.
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:43:20 +0100 (BST)
From: Alan Cox <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Suspected 21285 deadlock?

At this point you may like to know that the ESS tech 187x has a PIO mode
as well as DMA mode.
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 16:57:34 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jim Studt <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GNOME

I have built gnome (and glib, gtk...) on the Debian Netwinder base.

glib/gtk exercises a compiler bug and will fail its tests.  You can
avoid this by stripping the -O2 or whacking the zero_extendqidi op
from your arm.md in your egcs.  (Oh yeah, the faint of heart should
have stopped reading already.)

The resulting libs will fail in a couple of spots.  Changing tabs
on a tab set will fail.  List boxes get sized a little funny.  Both
of these need to be examined for their root cause.  May be a compiler
problem, may be an alignment problem, may be a surprise.

Most gtk programs seem to build well enough to use at least a bit.

orbit builds uneventfully.  Have no idea if its working correctly.

gnome builds nicely.  It doesn't work though.  I haven't waded in
to debug it yet.

I guess the bottom line is I don't have a tarball for you.  But there
is worthwhile work to be done if you wish to create one.

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                                     The Federated Software Group, Inc.
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 18:20:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Rod m. Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GNOME

On Sun, 25 Apr 1999, Jim Studt wrote:

> I have built gnome (and glib, gtk...) on the Debian Netwinder base.

I've built them on the Titan/Red Hat base stuff I have.  It took me about
6 hours to build all of the respective apps, in the proper build/install
order.

If you do decide to build all the apps yourself.  Go to the the GNOME web
page and they list the correct build order there.

I've only noticed one problem so far (excluding the glib problem), see
below, but I've not played with the GNOME or X stuff all that much.  I use
the source rpms that are in rawhide/starbuck from Red Hat without any
modifications.

> orbit builds uneventfully.  Have no idea if its working correctly.
> 
> gnome builds nicely.  It doesn't work though.  I haven't waded in
> to debug it yet.

I think I know what this is, and it relates to ORBit.  I've not found a
correct fix for it yet, so any pointers welcome.

The problem I've noticed with ORBit is it has a dynamic library that is
not compiled with PIC, having a bunch of R_ARM_PC24 in it.

	objdump --dynamic-reloc  /usr/lib/libIIOP.so |grep 24

- -Rms

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:50:59 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jim Studt <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GNOME

> The problem I've noticed with ORBit is it has a dynamic library that is
> not compiled with PIC, having a bunch of R_ARM_PC24 in it.
> 
> 	objdump --dynamic-reloc  /usr/lib/libIIOP.so |grep 24

egcs had a defect for PIC shared libs with c++ classess that use
multiple inheritence.  I've sent the patch out to philb, but for those
of you following along...

- --- egcs-1.1.1.63.orig+philb/gcc/config/arm/arm.h       Sun Apr 11 22:12:00 1999
+++ egcs-1.1.1.63/gcc/config/arm/arm.h  Sun Apr 11 21:01:17 1999
@@ -2031,7 +2031,7 @@
     }                                                                  \
   fputs ("\tb\t", FILE);                                               \
   assemble_name (FILE, XSTR (XEXP (DECL_RTL (FUNCTION), 0), 0));       \
- -  fputc ('\n', FILE);                                                  \
+  if (flag_pic) fputs ("(PLT)\n", FILE); else fputc('\n',FILE);        \
 } while (0)

 /* A C expression whose value is RTL representing the value of the return

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 19:30:23 -0400
From: Scott Bambrough <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GNOME

Rod m. Stewart wrote:
> 
> On Sun, 25 Apr 1999, Jim Studt wrote:
> 
> > I have built gnome (and glib, gtk...) on the Debian Netwinder base.
> 
> I've built them on the Titan/Red Hat base stuff I have.  It took me about
> 6 hours to build all of the respective apps, in the proper build/install
> order.
> 
> If you do decide to build all the apps yourself.  Go to the the GNOME web
> page and they list the correct build order there.
> 
> I've only noticed one problem so far (excluding the glib problem), see
> below, but I've not played with the GNOME or X stuff all that much.  I use
> the source rpms that are in rawhide/starbuck from Red Hat without any
> modifications.
> 
> > orbit builds uneventfully.  Have no idea if its working correctly.
> >
> > gnome builds nicely.  It doesn't work though.  I haven't waded in
> > to debug it yet.
> 
> I think I know what this is, and it relates to ORBit.  I've not found a
> correct fix for it yet, so any pointers welcome.
> 
> The problem I've noticed with ORBit is it has a dynamic library that is
> not compiled with PIC, having a bunch of R_ARM_PC24 in it.
> 
>         objdump --dynamic-reloc  /usr/lib/libIIOP.so |grep 24
> 

Actually, I know what the problem with this library is.  It is a stupid
programming error on the part of the author.  If you look at the make file, it
pulls object modules out of a precompiled STATIC library and links them into the
dynamic one.  Of course none of the object modules in the static library were
compiled with -fPIC.

Douglas couldn't get Orbit to run and I tracked it down to the above problem.  I
told him to just recompile the static library with -fPIC and it solved the
problem.  It shouldn't cause a problem in statically built programs as the
linker is capable of resolving all the relocs.

Unfortunately Douglas was a co-op and has returned to school.  And I can't
remember the object modules or static library name.  It wasn't too hard to trace
however.

Hope this helps.

Scott
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 19:35:53 -0400
From: Scott Bambrough <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GNOME

Jim Studt wrote:
> 
> glib/gtk exercises a compiler bug and will fail its tests.  You can
> avoid this by stripping the -O2 or whacking the zero_extendqidi op
> from your arm.md in your egcs.  (Oh yeah, the faint of heart should
> have stopped reading already.)

This is being worked on ATM.  Jim's whack of the zero_extendqidi op in arm.md is
a bit harsh.  You should only have to disable the memory alternative in this
op.  The real fix for this job is a lot of work, and may not be ready for the
EGCS 1.2 release.

I'll try and get a new version of EGCS built with an appropriate fix.  Andrew
wants one anyway.  

Scott
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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:13:04 -0400
From: Alexander Hutton <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

Ramus and all on list-

What kind of performance are people seeing from the Netwinders as web
servers in production?  My company is thinking of replacing our aging
SPARC 20, and the Netwinder has come up as an option.

Thanks

Alex

Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:
> 
> > I've got the RH5.1 setup -- has anyone compiled apache 1.3 for that? I'm
> > going to move websites and wanted the newer (1.3) httpd.conf format vs.
> > the more elderly 1.2x
> 
> Yup, works fine.  I haven't upgraded my Netwinder in ages and on mine I
> have to put two Listen directives in the httpd.conf file to work around an
> accept() bug somewhere.  But once I do that it works nicely.  It has been
> up and stable for months at: http://netwinder.lerdorf.on.ca
> 
> -Rasmus
> 
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- --------------------------------------------------------
| Alexander Hutton                                     
| Director of Sales and Marketing       
| Progressive Systems, Inc.                 
| 614.326.4600                          
| http://www.progressive-systems.com
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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:51:55 -0400
From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: unknow host system type

> When I run configure in some packages (gimp for example), I get
> 
> checking host system type... Invalid configuration
> `armv4l-unknown-linux-gnu': machine `armv4l-unknown' not recognized
> 
> and eventual failure. How do I get around this problem?
> Thanks for any clues. -ben

On a system with a correct libtools, and a newer version
of rpm, you change the "./configure" line in the spec file
to the macro "%configure".  The runs the command
"libtoolize --copy --force" which replaces the config.sub and
config.guess files with those form /usr/share/libtools

I submitted the libtools changes to Red Hat several weeks ago.

Otherwise you need to patch the files yourself.

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 15:30:03 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
From: Rasmus Lerdorf <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

> Rasmus and all on list-
> 
> What kind of performance are people seeing from the Netwinders as web
> servers in production?  My company is thinking of replacing our aging
> SPARC 20, and the Netwinder has come up as an option.

I ran a quick couple of benchmarks on my winder here.  I am still running
an ancient DM image and kernel 2.0.31.  (Someone point me to a no-brainer
way to upgrade my DM image please)

First run, using keepalives and 5 concurrent requests for a 1024 byte
document 10000 times:

- -----------------------------------------
Server Software:        Apache/1.3.7-dev                                   
Server Hostname:        localhost
Server Port:            80

Document Path:          /1k.html
Document Length:        1024 bytes

Concurrency Level:      5
Time taken for tests:   35.300 seconds
Complete requests:      10000
Failed requests:        0
Keep-Alive requests:    10000
Total transferred:      13280005 bytes
HTML transferred:       10240000 bytes
Requests per second:    283.29
Transfer rate:          376.20 kb/s received

Connnection Times (ms)
              min   avg   max
Connect:        0     0    30
Processing:     0    17   220
Total:          0    17   250
- --------------------------------------------

Second run, no keep-alive but otherwise the same:

- --------------------------------------------
Server Software:        Apache/1.3.7-dev                                   
Server Hostname:        localhost
Server Port:            80

Document Path:          /1k.html
Document Length:        1024 bytes

Concurrency Level:      5
Time taken for tests:   80.690 seconds
Complete requests:      10000
Failed requests:        0
Total transferred:      12892578 bytes
HTML transferred:       10242048 bytes
Requests per second:    123.93
Transfer rate:          159.78 kb/s received

Connnection Times (ms)
              min   avg   max
Connect:        0    16    40
Processing:    30    23   230
Total:         30    39   270
- --------------------------------------------

For static pages, your real-world rate is likely going to be somewhere
between these two numbers.  Probably around the 200 requests per second
range since you will have a combination of keep-alive and non-keepalive
requests happening.  And of course, your file sizes will affect things as
well. 1024 bytes is likely on the small side unless you have a lot of
small button images and such on your pages.

- -Rasmus

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 20:47:28 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3? 

Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:

>I ran a quick couple of benchmarks on my winder here.  I am still running
>an ancient DM image and kernel 2.0.31.  (Someone point me to a no-brainer
>way to upgrade my DM image please)

For what it's worth, I'd hope that glibc 2.1 + kernel 2.2 would give a 
measurable performance increase for this sort of test.  If you can point 
me to a copy of the code you used for benchmarking I'd be interested to see 
whether the numbers I get on my machine are any different.

p.

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 15:51:18 -0400
From: Ralph Siemsen <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:

> I ran a quick couple of benchmarks on my winder here.  I am still running
> an ancient DM image and kernel 2.0.31.  (Someone point me to a no-brainer
> way to upgrade my DM image please)

I'm workin' on it :)  The Firmware-HOWTO is done, the Kernel-HOWTO is mostly
done, and next will be the Disk-Upgrade-HOWTO.  Hopefully by next week.

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 16:00:05 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
From: Rasmus Lerdorf <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

> >I ran a quick couple of benchmarks on my winder here.  I am still running
> >an ancient DM image and kernel 2.0.31.  (Someone point me to a no-brainer
> >way to upgrade my DM image please)
> 
> For what it's worth, I'd hope that glibc 2.1 + kernel 2.2 would give a 
> measurable performance increase for this sort of test.  If you can point 
> me to a copy of the code you used for benchmarking I'd be interested to see 
> whether the numbers I get on my machine are any different.

I just the standard ApacheBench (ab) that comes with Apache.

  ab -n 10000 -c 5 -k localhost/1k.html

And you can fetch the 1k.html file I used from:

  http://netwinder.lerdorf.on.ca/1k.html

- -Rasmus

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 16:05:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

On Mon, 26 Apr 1999, Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:

> I ran a quick couple of benchmarks on my winder here.  I am still running
> an ancient DM image and kernel 2.0.31.  (Someone point me to a no-brainer
> way to upgrade my DM image please)

Actually, I did this about a month ago. Other than the corrections I
posted to the list about how I got NeTTrom to work for my scenario, I had no
problems. It will likely be trickier if you have a small hard drive
though.

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"At a risk of being called sexist, ageist and French, if you put 
multimedia, a leather skirt and lipstick on a grandmother and take her 
to a night club, she's still not going to get lucky." -- Jean Louis 
Gassee (of Be) on Windows 2000 being "multimedia."

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Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:11:37 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

I ran the same benchmarks as Rasmus on my NetWinder.  The results are quite 
interesting; on the keepalive case there's an improvement, but the 
no-keepalive numbers are almost exactly the same.  The max connection times 
are also quite wildly different for some reason.  Anyway, here are the 
numbers:

$ ab -n 10000 -c 5 -k localhost:8080/1k.html 
This is ApacheBench, Version 1.3
Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/
Copyright (c) 1998-1999 The Apache Group, http://www.apache.org/

Server Software:        Apache/1.3.6                                       
Server Hostname:        localhost
Server Port:            8080

Document Path:          /1k.html
Document Length:        1024 bytes

Concurrency Level:      5
Time taken for tests:   29.262 seconds
Complete requests:      10000
Failed requests:        0
Keep-Alive requests:    9907
Total transferred:      13068344 bytes
HTML transferred:       10242048 bytes
Requests per second:    341.74
Transfer rate:          446.60 kb/s received

Connnection Times (ms)
              min   avg   max
Connect:        0     0    26
Processing:     3    14    32
Total:          3    14    58

$ ab -n 10000 -c 5 localhost:8080/1k.html
This is ApacheBench, Version 1.3
Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/
Copyright (c) 1998-1999 The Apache Group, http://www.apache.org/

Server Software:        Apache/1.3.6                                       
Server Hostname:        localhost
Server Port:            8080

Document Path:          /1k.html
Document Length:        1024 bytes

Concurrency Level:      5
Time taken for tests:   80.971 seconds
Complete requests:      10000
Failed requests:        0
Total transferred:      12702540 bytes
HTML transferred:       10242048 bytes
Requests per second:    123.50
Transfer rate:          156.88 kb/s received

Connnection Times (ms)
              min   avg   max
Connect:        0     9   101
Processing:    10    29   788
Total:         10    38   889

p.

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Date: 27 Apr 1999 10:59:44 +0100
From: Dag Brattli <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz

Russell King - ARM Linux Admin <[email-masked]> writes:

> This, I hope, is going to be the final pre-patch release.  However, I am
> still awaiting a response from a couple of people to say whether there
> are any more problems.

Hi,

Have just upgraded to pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1, to try and solve the 4Mbps IrDA
problems, but and I have a few problems using this patch:

1) ARP. I cannot make the NetWinder answer ARP requests from other
   machines.

2) ping -f kills the NetWinder. Running tcpspray against the NetWinder will 
   also kill it.

BTW: I had none of these bugs in 2.2.2-rmk4-philb which was the last kernel 
I tested. Sorry for not having any more details!

- -- Dag

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 /// http://www.cs.uit.no/~dagb    | http://www.cs.uit.no/linux-irda/   ///
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Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:04:02 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3? 

Couple of other thoughts on Apache performance for anybody who's interested 
in these things.  At the moment it's rather over-keen to mmap() static files.  
Although Linux in general has a pretty lightweight mmap, it's probably not 
that great an idea to use it for very small files especially on StrongARM 
systems.  If you wind MMAP_THRESHOLD up a bit (I'd guess 16k or 32k might be a 
good number to try) or so you can get another slight increase in performance.

Also, benchmarking from localhost is slightly misleading because the benchmark 
program is fighting the web server for the CPU and one area the NetWinder is 
quite weak in is process context switches.  I get better numbers benchmarking 
across 10Mbps ethernet than over loopback.

With MMAP_THRESHOLD=32k, benchmarking from my Intel machine these are the 
results I get.

Concurrency Level:      5
Time taken for tests:   27.318 seconds
Complete requests:      10000
Failed requests:        0
Keep-Alive requests:    9903
Total transferred:      13065633 bytes
HTML transferred:       10240000 bytes
Requests per second:    366.06
Transfer rate:          478.28 kb/s received

A threaded Apache would probably win quite noticeably on a NetWinder compared 
to the multi-process model it currently uses.  Whether we're likely ever to 
see one of those I don't know.

p.

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 07:21:06 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
From: Rasmus Lerdorf <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Apache 1.3?

> A threaded Apache would probably win quite noticeably on a NetWinder compared 
> to the multi-process model it currently uses.  Whether we're likely ever to 
> see one of those I don't know.

There is already a working prototype of a threaded Apache which is going
to end up becoming Apache 2.0.  I haven't sat down to see how well it
works on the Netwinder yet.  I'll get to that.

- -Rasmus

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Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:36:50 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz

Dag Brattli writes:
> Have just upgraded to pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1, to try and solve the 4Mbps IrDA
> problems, but and I have a few problems using this patch:
> 
> 1) ARP. I cannot make the NetWinder answer ARP requests from other
>    machines.
> 
> 2) ping -f kills the NetWinder. Running tcpspray against the NetWinder will 
>    also kill it.

Which interface is this?  Is it the tulip driver?  If so, I'm going to
revert to the driver that was in 2.2.5-rmk3.
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |         Russell King        [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |   http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/aboutme.html    /  /  |
  | +-+-+                                                     --- -+-
  /   |               THE developer of ARM Linux              |+| /|\
 /  | | |                                                     ---  |
    +-+-+ -------------------------------------------------  /\\\  |
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Date: 27 Apr 1999 13:33:15 +0100
From: Dag Brattli <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz

Russell King <[email-masked]> writes:

> > 1) ARP. I cannot make the NetWinder answer ARP requests from other
> >    machines.
> > 
> > 2) ping -f kills the NetWinder. Running tcpspray against the NetWinder will 
> >    also kill it.
> 
> Which interface is this?  Is it the tulip driver?  If so, I'm going to
> revert to the driver that was in 2.2.5-rmk3.

Yes, it's the tulip driver. I've just tried the version from my 2.2.2-x-y
kernel with the 2.2.6-rmk1 kernel, and the problems disappeared :-)

- -- Dag

- -- 
   / Dag Brattli                   | The Linux-IrDA Project               /
  // University of Tromsoe, Norway | Infrared communication for Linux    //
 /// http://www.cs.uit.no/~dagb    | http://www.cs.uit.no/linux-irda/   ///
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Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:51:03 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk1.gz

Dag Brattli writes:
> Russell King <[email-masked]> writes:
> > Which interface is this?  Is it the tulip driver?  If so, I'm going to
> > revert to the driver that was in 2.2.5-rmk3.
> 
> Yes, it's the tulip driver. I've just tried the version from my 2.2.2-x-y
> kernel with the 2.2.6-rmk1 kernel, and the problems disappeared :-)

Ok, 2.2.6-rmk2 is now on the site, which has the old driver in there.
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |         Russell King        [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |   http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/aboutme.html    /  /  |
  | +-+-+                                                     --- -+-
  /   |               THE developer of ARM Linux              |+| /|\
 /  | | |                                                     ---  |
    +-+-+ -------------------------------------------------  /\\\  |
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:53:06 +0100 (BST)
From: Russell King - ARM Linux Admin <[email-masked]>
Subject: 2.2.6-rmk2

Hi all,

pre-patch-2.2.6-rmk2.gz is now on the ftp.arm.linux.org.uk ftp site.  There's
not a lot of difference between this and -rmk1, mainly it's a revery back to
the old tulip driver.

If anyone has any problems at all with this kernel, please let me know.
   _____
  |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+-
  |   |        Russell King       [email-masked]      --- ---
  | | | |  http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/~rmk/armlinux.html    /  /  |
  | +-+-+                                                     --- -+-
  /   |               THE developer of ARM Linux              |+| /|\
 /  | | |                                                     ---  |
    +-+-+ -------------------------------------------------  /\\\  |
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:49:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Benchmarks was Re: Apache 1.3?

On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Philip Blundell wrote:

> I ran the same benchmarks as Rasmus on my NetWinder.

Speaking of Benchmarks, I noticed that when I upgraded from the RH 4.2
image to the RH 5.1 image, my RC5 key rate went from 400k keys to about
350k. I was puzzled as I didn't see any obvious differences in what it was
running....

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"Solving today's problems tomorrow, with yesterday's technology."

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:57:30 -0400
From: Ralph Siemsen <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Benchmarks was Re: Apache 1.3?

Deirdre Saoirse wrote:

> Speaking of Benchmarks, I noticed that when I upgraded from the RH 4.2
> image to the RH 5.1 image, my RC5 key rate went from 400k keys to about
> 350k. I was puzzled as I didn't see any obvious differences in what it was
> running....

Hmm... you might check to see if under 4.2, you had an over-inflated
bogomips rating - if you've still got old copies of dmesg output, this would
be easy.  Did you ever have the clock-drifting problems?  

- -- 
Ralph Siemsen -- [email-masked]
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Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:22:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Benchmarks was Re: Apache 1.3?

On Tue, 27 Apr 1999, Ralph Siemsen wrote:

> Hmm... you might check to see if under 4.2, you had an over-inflated
> bogomips rating - if you've still got old copies of dmesg output, this would
> be easy.  Did you ever have the clock-drifting problems?  

My clock didn't just drift, it downright floated. I noticed that is no
longer a problem (yay!).

So likely that was the problem. No, I don't have old dmesg around, but
that explanation makes sense.

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"Solving today's problems tomorrow, with yesterday's technology."

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 20:08:15 -0500
From: Douglas Paul <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GNOME

Scott Bambrough wrote:

> Unfortunately Douglas was a co-op and has returned to school.  And I can't
> remember the object modules or static library name.  It wasn't too hard to trace
> however.

As far as I remember, it was the tcpwrappers library that it was using that caused
the problem.

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* Doug Paul
*
* E-Mail: [email-masked]
*         [email-masked]
* ICQ:    4394172
* Pager:  [email-masked]

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 09:31:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Chuck Stuart <[email-masked]>
Subject: Memory

Picking up on theme expressed a few weeks ago...

My 'Winder is 'Whining for more memory (I'm throwing my voice).  Is there
a supplier for these pieces at quantities of 1?

_________________________________________________________

Chuck Stuart				The Budd Company
Supv., Structural Design		Design Center
Network Manager				Troy, MI  U.S.A.

#!/bin/perl -sp0777i<X+d*lMLa^*lN%0]dsXx++lMlN/dsM0<j]dsj
$/=unpack('H*',$_);$_=`echo 16dio\U$k"SK$/SM$n\EsN0p[lN*1
lK[d2%Sa2/d0$^Ixp"|dc`;s/\W//g;$_=pack('H*',/((..)*)$/)
_________________________________________________________

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:04:31 -0400
From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Memory

Chuck Stuart wrote:
> My 'Winder is 'Whining for more memory (I'm throwing my voice).  Is there
> a supplier for these pieces at quantities of 1?

I'm personally not aware of any, nor of any plans to offer an upgrade.
[But then I'm not part of the hardware or sales teams.]

The only good news I can share is that the hardware team borrowed my
128 MB module to learn how to duplicate it (the person that made it is
no longer with us).  I have it back now, which is a good thing since
apparently 4 people here started drooling over it and asking for it :D
It appears that 128 MB requests are being placed.

- --
Andrew E. Mileski - Software Engineer
Hardware Canada Computing
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Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:19:50 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Eric LaForest)
Subject: Re: Memory

>The only good news I can share is that the hardware team borrowed my
>128 MB module to learn how to duplicate it (the person that made it is
>no longer with us).  I have it back now, which is a good thing since
>apparently 4 people here started drooling over it and asking for it :D
>It appears that 128 MB requests are being placed.
>
>--
>Andrew E. Mileski - Software Engineer
>Hardware Canada Computing

Any work towards the full moby?
(256MB of ram...saw one early proto in older days)

- --
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#define Hacker !(Cracker)  //FYI: http://sagan.earthspace.net/~esr/
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Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 11:51:19 -0400
From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Memory

Eric LaForest wrote:
> Any work towards the full moby?
> (256MB of ram...saw one early proto in older days)

I've never seen one, and don't have any info on one.
This would require two sockets as well.

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Hardware Canada Computing
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Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 14:15:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Eric LaForest)
Subject: Re: Memory

>
>Eric LaForest wrote:
>> Any work towards the full moby?
>> (256MB of ram...saw one early proto in older days)
>
>I've never seen one, and don't have any info on one.
>This would require two sockets as well.
>
>--
>Andrew E. Mileski - Software Engineer
>Hardware Canada Computing

It was a double length card.

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:16:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deirdre Saoirse <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Memory

On Wed, 28 Apr 1999, Andrew E. Mileski wrote:

> The only good news I can share is that the hardware team borrowed my
> 128 MB module to learn how to duplicate it (the person that made it is
> no longer with us).  I have it back now, which is a good thing since
> apparently 4 people here started drooling over it and asking for it :D
> It appears that 128 MB requests are being placed.

Oooers -- but I'm glad you got your RAM back. :)

_Deirdre   *   http://www.linuxcabal.org   *   http://www.deirdre.net
"Solving today's problems tomorrow, with yesterday's technology."

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:34:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan Foster Kliegman <[email-masked]>
Subject: TCP performance numbers

While I don't have a netwinder, I've got an EBSA-285 similar board and
have been seeing weird results with TCP/IP performance numbres.  UDP
traffic (<~1400 byte packets to avoid IP Fragmentation) gives me 80 Mbps
send and receive over 100baseT.  TCP traffic gives me 40-60Mbps send,
but only 4Mbps receive.  Anyone have any idea what could be causing this
or if they had the same problem and fixed it?  I'm using a 2.2.1 kernel.

- -Jon 
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Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 20:56:13 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TCP performance numbers 

>While I don't have a netwinder, I've got an EBSA-285 similar board and
>have been seeing weird results with TCP/IP performance numbres.  UDP
>traffic (<~1400 byte packets to avoid IP Fragmentation) gives me 80 Mbps
>send and receive over 100baseT.  TCP traffic gives me 40-60Mbps send,
>but only 4Mbps receive.  Anyone have any idea what could be causing this
>or if they had the same problem and fixed it?  I'm using a 2.2.1 kernel.

Try upgrading to a later kernel - there have been some TCP changes since 2.2.1.
If you still have trouble, it would be helpful if you could post a tcpdump 
trace of the slow reception, and mention what the system you're talking to is.

p.

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:10:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan Foster Kliegman <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TCP performance numbers

Excerpts from netwinder: 28-Apr-99 Re: TCP performance numbers  by
Philip [email-masked] 
> Try upgrading to a later kernel - there have been some TCP changes
since 2.2.1.
> If you still have trouble, it would be helpful if you could post a tcpdump 
> trace of the slow reception, and mention what the system you're
talking to is.

Unfortunately upgrading to a new kernel is problematic since the 2.2.1
tree I have was given to me and modified in several places (I don't have
a consistant set of patches I can apply to a new kernel to bring it up
to date).  Attempts so far at upgrading the kernel have failed.  

The system on the remote end is a P2-300 with a 2.0.35 kernel and a
P2-200 with a 2.2.0 kernel.  Results were similar between both.

Here's a small portion of the tcpdump trace between the systems.  STIMPY
is the EBSA-285 based system and serenity is the Intel 2.0.35 machine. 
The trace was generated on stimpy and the network testing done via
tcpblast-19981112.  Similar results were seen using ttcp as well for
testing.  

15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32520041:32521501(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
P 32521501:32522961(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32522961 win 5840 (DF)
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32522961:32524421(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32524421:32525881(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32525881 win 2920 (DF)
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32525881:32527341(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32527341:32528801(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32528801 win 1460 (DF)
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32528801:32530261(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32530261 win 1460 (DF)
15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32530261:32531721(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.042361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32531721 win 1460 (DF)
15:35:59.042361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32531721 win 4380 (DF)
15:35:59.042361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32531721:32533181(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.042361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32533181:32534641(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.042361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32534641:32536101(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.042361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32533181 win 8760 (DF)
15:35:59.042361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
. ack 32536101 win 7300 (DF)
15:35:59.042361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32536101:32537561(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.042361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
P 32537561:32539021(1460) ack 1 win 32120
15:35:59.042361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32539021:32540481(1460) ack 1 win 32120

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Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:20:03 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TCP performance numbers 

>a consistant set of patches I can apply to a new kernel to bring it up
>to date).  Attempts so far at upgrading the kernel have failed.  

Hmm.  On an EBSA-285 any recent 2.2 kernel ought to work really.  What 
problems were you having?

>15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
>. 32520041:32521501(1460) ack 1 win 32120
>15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
>P 32521501:32522961(1460) ack 1 win 32120

I'm deeply suspicious of those timestamps - it looks like gettimeoffset() 
isn't operating correctly on your machine.  Do you have a third system on the 
wire you could run traces on (this is good practice in general)?  Anyway:

>15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
>. ack 32528801 win 1460 (DF)
>15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
>. 32528801:32530261(1460) ack 1 win 32120
>15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
>. ack 32530261 win 1460 (DF)
>15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
>. 32530261:32531721(1460) ack 1 win 32120
>15:35:59.042361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
>. ack 32531721 win 1460 (DF)

As far as I can make out nothing is grossly wrong here.  However, you only 
seem to have a very small receive window open and so the transfer has 
degenerated to almost an Xmodem type situation where the sender is having to 
stop and await acknowledges before it can go on.  I suspect this can happen if 
the receiving process doesn't pull data out of the socket buffers fast enough.
Can you use strace to see what the receiver (probably inetd I guess) is up to 
and make sure it's not doing anything pathological like reading in 1-byte blocks?

(It would help to see the first few packets of the transaction where the SYN 
exchange happens, incidentally.)

With higher-speed networks latency becomes as important as bandwidth, and at 
even 100Mbps you need a fair sized window if it's not to be a constraint.

p.

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Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:04:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan Foster Kliegman <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TCP performance numbers

Excerpts from netwinder: 28-Apr-99 Re: TCP performance numbers  by
Philip [email-masked] 
> Hmm.  On an EBSA-285 any recent 2.2 kernel ought to work really.  What 
> problems were you having?

Unfortunately it's not an EBSA-285 that I'm running on, rather custom
hardware which closely resembles it (i.e. footbridge based with a Tulip
21143).  There are a bunch of changes made to the 2.2.1 source code I
have and it doesn't seem to be built off of a consistant set of patches
(i.e. getting a fresh 2-1, applying yours and Russel's patches and doing
a diff is real ugly - it looks like patches may have been selectively
applied).  Trying to build from a fresh kernel causes an endless loop of
print's during booting, usually it ends up printing 'Calibrating delay
loop' endlessly although it has happened at a few other points early on
in the boot process.
  
> I'm deeply suspicious of those timestamps - it looks like gettimeoffset() 
> isn't operating correctly on your machine.  Do you have a third system
on the 
> wire you could run traces on (this is good practice in general)?  Anyway:

Unfortunately the two machines are connected either through a switch or
a point-to-point connection.  I don't believe the tcpdump run is causing
the bandwidth problem because it exists without it.  When I run tcpdump
on the P2 I get a slightly different result - I end up seeing multiple
ACKS from the EBSA-285 machine for the same byte yet I don't see any
retransmissions of packets.  Here's a brief clip from that trace.  Once
again, serenity is the P2 running 2.0.35 and STIMPY is the EBSA-285
running 2.2.1
19:22:18.594975 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32596321:32597781(1460) ack 1 win 32120
19:22:18.594975 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32597781:32599241(1460) ack 1 win 32120
19:22:18.594975 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115:
. ack 32591941 win 27740 (DF)
19:22:18.594975 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115:
. ack 32591941 win 27740 (DF)
19:22:18.594975 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115:
. ack 32591941 win 27740 (DF)
19:22:18.794975 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32591941:32593401(1460) ack 1 win 32120
19:22:18.794975 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115:
. ack 32594861 win 29200 (DF)
19:22:18.794975 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32594861:32596321(1460) ack 1 win 32120
19:22:18.794975 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.25115 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
. 32596321:32597781(1460) ack 1 win 32120

> >15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
> >. ack 32528801 win 1460 (DF)
> >15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
> >. 32528801:32530261(1460) ack 1 win 32120
> >15:35:59.032361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
> >. ack 32530261 win 1460 (DF)
> >15:35:59.032361 serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820 > STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard:
> >. 32530261:32531721(1460) ack 1 win 32120
> >15:35:59.042361 STIMPY.ECE.CMU.EDU.discard > serenity.ece.cmu.edu.30820:
> >. ack 32531721 win 1460 (DF)
>  
> As far as I can make out nothing is grossly wrong here.  However, you only 
> seem to have a very small receive window open and so the transfer has 
> degenerated to almost an Xmodem type situation where the sender is having to 
> stop and await acknowledges before it can go on.  I suspect this can
happen if 
> the receiving process doesn't pull data out of the socket buffers fast
enough.
> Can you use strace to see what the receiver (probably inetd I guess)
is up to 
> and make sure it's not doing anything pathological like reading in
1-byte blocks
> ?
>  
> (It would help to see the first few packets of the transaction where the SYN 
> exchange happens, incidentally.)
>  
> With higher-speed networks latency becomes as important as bandwidth, and at 
> even 100Mbps you need a fair sized window if it's not to be a constraint.
>  
> p.
>  

Sorry - I had snipped the beginning of the trace in the interest of
brevity and guess I snipped to much.  I observer larger window sizes
(32K) at the beginning of the traffic but the window size degrades over
time.  I was confused because I noticed the window size decreasing
despite the ACK's.  The EBSA-based system would receive 1K, acknowledge
it, but shrink the window that was available.  

Anyway - I've put the full set of traces on a web page (to save everyone
else on this list from having to read them).  Its:
http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~jk8q/tcpdump_log.tgz
It has four files:
serenity_to_stimpy.stimpy.log
serenity_to_stimpy.serenity.log
stimpy_to_serenity.stimpy.log
stimpy_to_serenity.serenity.log

The four files are available at the web site individually as well.  The
first part of the filename is the traffic direction, the second part is
the host the test ran on.  The tar file is 750K, the logs are between
2-4 MB each.

Thanks for all your help already!

- -Jon

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:49:44 -0400
From: Woody Suwalski <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Memory

I suspect it was a prototype of our 128M module...

Woody

Eric LaForest wrote:
> 
> >
> >Eric LaForest wrote:
> >> Any work towards the full moby?
> >> (256MB of ram...saw one early proto in older days)
> >
> >I've never seen one, and don't have any info on one.
> >This would require two sockets as well.
> >
> >--
> >Andrew E. Mileski - Software Engineer
> >Hardware Canada Computing
> 
> It was a double length card.
> 
> --
> Eric LaForest      Nascent Linux Borg     -www.ncf.carleton.ca/~di458-
> #define Hacker !(Cracker)  //FYI: http://sagan.earthspace.net/~esr/
> Breaking into computers does not make one a hacker, for the same reasons
> that hotwiring cars does not make one a mechanic... paraphr. from ESR
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:50:47 +0100
From: Philip Blundell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TCP performance numbers 

>brevity and guess I snipped to much.  I observer larger window sizes
>(32K) at the beginning of the traffic but the window size degrades over
>time.  I was confused because I noticed the window size decreasing
>despite the ACK's.  The EBSA-based system would receive 1K, acknowledge
>it, but shrink the window that was available.  

That would happen in the scenario I suggested yesterday where the receiving 
process is too slow.  The network stack keeps track of the amount of memory in 
socket buffers and it will shrink the window if data starts backing up inside 
the kernel, to try to avoid a socket that isn't being read from consuming all 
available memory.  It will still ACK the incoming data otherwise the sender 
would start doing retransmits.

Did you get a chance to use strace to inspect the receiving process?  I'll 
try to find time to look at the full traces later this morning.

p.

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:50:17 -0700 (BST)
From: Tim Rowledge <[email-masked]>
Subject: video in/out problems

I'm still trying to work out how to handle video in and out on my NW.

I found the /usr/diag/testscripts programs; all work _except_ for the video
capture related one.  Seems a bit bad that a diagnostic program won't run :-(

So far I've discovered that the copy of 'insmod' installed in that directory
seems to cause some part of the problem; if I move it out of the way there is
one less error, and I even get a 'mirror' of the display on the video monitor.
However, moving to the second step of the test which is supposed to capture
video, just makes the video monitor go bluescreen and  no video is captured.

The tv_test program in video_aout/tv seems to work in as much as  it lets you
set some parameters or other ( I haven't changed anything since I have no idea
what that might do) and exits cleanly.

The videocap_test program in video_aout/vidcap does _not_ work but fails with
'hasmode() failed'. The source suggests it is trying to swap to mode
G640x480x16M. This has lead me down the annoying path of attempting to  work
out how to set up svgalib. I have copied the modeline stuff from my
XFree86Config file, as per the comments in /etc/vga/libvga.config, but it
appears to make no difference. I am runnning this as root, from a plain virtual
terminal.

Can anyone out there actually run the video capture and display diagnostic? Can
you point me to documentation that might help understand this?

tim

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 [email-masked] (h)  <http://sumeru.stanford.edu/tim>

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End of devel-digest V2 #155
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